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Blanket or bulbs?
http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=9102		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  James Orr [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:11 am ]
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Hi everyone

I'm prepping for my bending. It's going to be a one time job. I'll either
get one of John How's blankets with a temp control for $140, or use
bulbs.

If I get the blanket I'll plan on putting it back up on luthiers auctions once
I'm done with it to try to make some of the money back up.

The $10-$15 cost for the bulb setup is really attractive

My last blanket was the victim of an unfortunate brain fart and burned
itself up.

The bulbs seem a lot more desirable from my perspective, but I'm
wondering if they'll get up to temp; and if they will, will they take so long
to get there that the water will evaporate by the time they're there?

Can anyone shed some thoughts?
Author:  Don Williams [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:13 am ]
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I won't use bulbs. I have had way too much success with blankets, and I've heard too many horror stories about using bulbs.
Buy them and sell them if you must, but blankets are the way to go.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:28 am ]
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I started with bulbs. The temperature rise was rather slow and I believe inconsistent. I now have a blanket on top and the combination works well. It gets up to temperature as quickly as you want and maintains its heat using the controller that John Hall sells.
Author:  Peter J [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:30 am ]
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James,

I built my side bender with the 3 bulbs and have found that the blanket is much quicker when it comes to getting up to temperature. When used with a rheostat the temperature control is much better and more accurately controlled than with the bulbs & dimmer switch approach. I use the blanket exclusively now and have relegated the light bulbs to the shelf in the utility room.

Regards,

Pete
Author:  James Orr [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:42 am ]
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Thanks guys. I'm not really concerned with how long it'll take to get to
temp. At this hobby level, I'd prolong most processes if I could for the
fun. I'd like a decent bend, that's all. Flamed mahogany.
Author:  Andy Zimmerman [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:45 am ]
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Use the blankets!!!!! They are great. Even heat!!!!
John H's are great.
Just use a thermometer with it and a timer. He sells his with a timer
Author:  Marc [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:50 am ]
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I use bulbs. I've never had a problem. But they seem to draw a lot of complaints.
Author:  MSpencer [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:14 am ]
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James, if you are planning to resell the blanket and are only doing A guitar. I would go with the bulbs. This process get criticized and like Marc said lots of complaints, but I use 3 - 200W bulbs in a Fox style bender I built myself and it works fine. It is not fast, but it gets the job done but you have to be a little more patient. I don't know anything different so I guess I don't know what I'm missing.

Mike
Author:  Jim Watts [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:26 am ]
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I use a blanket, but used bulbs before that and they work. I do like the blanket better, but many have used bulbs. The original fox bender was designed around bulbs.
For one guitar however why not bend on a hot pipe? It's great experience.
Author:  James Orr [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:41 am ]
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Thanks guys. I really appreciate the thoughts! Pros and cons. I believe
I'm sold on the bulbs but want to see if there's something I'm not aware
of that will sway me towards the blanket. I do agree blankets are better.      

Hesh, the bender I used to use would be what people were calling a
Doolin style bender last week. It's a mold with some eye screws and what
not screwed in directly. I'm just going to make another like it for this
body shape I'm using. I even just push the waist call down and clamp it
with a bar clamp.

Jim I tried a pipe once and honestly couldn't do it. I had a $10 scrap side
from LMI that I would rock back on it and forth without luck. I'm not
confident that I could achieve symetry.
Author:  fryovanni [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:59 am ]
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Bulbs are slow. and I use a heat gun to help get the set up to temp(I also use foil to help contain the heat). It has worked fine, but I think Mattia has convinced me to switch to blankets.

Peace,Rich
Author:  old man [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:41 pm ]
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I'm using bulbs and they work well, but slow. I'll get a blanket when I can afford it. My bender is more of a doolin style too.

Ron
Author:  K.O. [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:47 pm ]
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I use a hot pipe and my BBQ.
Author:  Mario [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:47 pm ]
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For a one time deal, or even just a few per year, go with the pipe. It's much more fun, and a skill that is useful. And K.O., I, too, have bent wood on my BBQ grill's lid <bg> I was doing ribs last summer, and the medium heat seemed about right, and I had a mandolin set to bend, so.... bent like a charm!

I used to use bulbs in my bender, and they worked, but the temperature varied all over the place, with hot spots that would lightly scorch in one area, and cold areas where the ribs would often crack.

The blanket pays for itself with the first set of ribs you -don't- break. If you must use a bender, get a blanket.... So much sweeter.
Author:  tippie53 [ Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:18 pm ]
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    The hot pipe is a great thing to use at least once as you can attain a feel for bending that way. Blankets are the best way as the heat is ery controllable over light bulbs.
   Now for the big question , what are you bending and what shape are you trying to attain? If you are bending a highly figured wood , the bulbs may cause some problems.
     For a guitar or 2 here is what you can do. 3 bulbs
2 150's and 1 200
150 at the upper and waist and 200 at the lower bout, You didn't mention the patter , what you you using ? I find that metal slats you needed to carry the heat as a thermal mass. Don't soak the wood but spray it and keep it damp as you bend. Allow the heat to build into the wood as forcing the wood will crack it .
      Take your time and use a practice piece so you can see if you have any hot spots as the bulbs heat is not controllable and you may be surprised at how some areas can get so hot while others stay cool.
   I have some instruction at my site blues creek guitars that will help I hope.
Good luck.
PS you can use a cloths iron set to high heat to help with the harder radii, The lower bout can bend alot easier than the waist and upper bout.
Author:  Serge Poirier [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 1:34 am ]
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I use both the bulbs and the blanket on my home made side bender and i love it, very quick. Also made myself a hot pipe cuz i felt i was missing on something and used it to bend bindings and purfs.
Author:  K.O. [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:21 am ]
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I have to admit an addiction to feeling what the wood is doing as I work it to shape, It is almost the processes being more important than the result, very soul satisfying. Lucky/unlucky enough to not have customers.

That being said the more professional the tools the more professional & consistent the results.

When I was very young one of my grandfathers friends built fiddles. He cold bent the ribs. His drying forms were simply cuts in a board.
Author:  K.O. [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:50 am ]
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The reason I use my BBQ is it has about a 2 ft. radius with about a 2.5 in. chimney which allows me to heat a large area at once to a pliable state and then use the chimney to refine to final shape. I used a bowl of water and white tee-shirt for wetting.
I feel it gives me some of advantages of the fox type bender with the advantage of being able to feel
just how pliable the whole section of curve is.

With just a hot pipe or bending iron pliability is much more localized.

I've only bent birdseye maple, curly maple, butternut, oak, walnut, cherry and african mahogany so far. I used a strap with the figured woods and a lot less water with the mahog. With them all I could feel when the wood relaxed and was ready to bend. The mahogany seemed to require a slightly more sensitive feel and seemed to be in danger of becoming brittle if worked to long.

Well thats what works for me, so far....
Author:  BlueSpirit [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 10:05 am ]
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I vote for the blankets which give a nice EVEN heat throughout the wood, where as bulbs don't do that. The space between the bulbs is not as hot as the space right above the bulb, hence the heat is uneven.
Just my opinion as I've use both and am well satisfied with the blanket.
Author:  James Orr [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:33 am ]
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Thanks guys. It's hard not to just order one of John's. I want to be sure
of what I'm doing first though.

Last night as I was ordering 120 hotdogs and 80 burgers at church, I
wondered about lining a form with stainless steel and just using some
torches under it. A glorified bending iron.

I like the idea of an iron and bulbs. Then what I'm left wondering about is
doing the waist. How would I do the waist? Just bending without the
iron, using only the bulb?
Author:  KiwiCraig [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:16 pm ]
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G'day James,
                   3 X 200 watt bulbs can and will do the job. Bulbs take longer to warm up the sides , so I wrapped the sides in foil to retain the moisture a little longer . Another good tip from my good mate Paul B. is to aid the heating with a hot air gun . I do have a dimmer for the bulbs and use a thermometer.

I just bent a set @ .1 " and all went well , although ,as others testify , the blanket may be superior.

Regards , Craig Lawrence

KiwiCraig39022.8537731481
Author:  James Orr [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:32 pm ]
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That's a vote of confidence I'm grateful for! How do you have your
dimmer set up?
Author:  KiwiCraig [ Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:11 pm ]
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G'day James,
                  All three bulbs are fed to the dimmer ,which I have mounted on the bender . Check that your dimmer can handle the wattage . Mine is 600 watt, so just handles it and no more . A higher wattage one would have cost an arm and a leg .
I have read where others have used more than one dimmer ,so they can dim the bulbs individually.

Good luck James!

Craig LawrenceKiwiCraig39023.2030092593
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